For The Love Of Fandom

[teddy_radiator]

I've just read a very sad FB post from one of my favourite authors, J.R. Ward, of Black Dagger Brotherhood fame. What is more upsetting to me is the replies she received. It concerns fanfiction and role play, which she is violently against. "I have nothing against RP or fanfiction, I just do not want anyone to use my characters." The comments that followed about fanfic and RP sickened me. It's very upsetting how the majority of her fans see it as at worst, a form of blatant plagiarism, and at the very least, a very sad and pitiable group of people trying to ride an author's coattails or 'bring joy to their sad, pathetic lives'. There were one or two voices of reason, but they were shot down by the others as crackpots, and even worse, 'not a proper fan'. NOT a proper fan? Is there any fan so loyal, so protective of a character, so in love with a fandom than those who role play, or write fanfiction or create fanart or fandom-based music? And just because it's fanfiction or fanart or RP, these are not 'proper' authors or artists or performers?

I appreciate that I am an author with very few sales under my belt. But I love my characters and protect them just as fiercely as any writer. Yet, as I read all this, I just reverted to my inner sixteen year old, and thought to myself, "One day, when my characters are well-known, I'm going to encourage all the fanfiction and RP-ing anyone wants to do with them." Fanfiction and RP keeps a fandom alive long after the author has left those characters behind and moved on. These forms of fanbased art can introduce others to a fandom - they can encourage authors and artists and RP-ers to try, and grow and learn their craft.

I realise that some authors vehemently oppose their characters as the subject for fanfiction, and their reasons are right for them. But it still saddens me that those of us who love this creative outlet, who have learned their craft and given so much of ourselves to this harmless, non-profit-making hobby, who enjoy one another's company and who encourage each other to dream big and bring to life these characters we know and love are often ridiculed or dismissed. And what's worse, I know that no matter what anyone does or says, Ms. Ward will still believe that fanfiction and RP 'harms' the brand. What a load of Friar's Balsam.

Comments

[akatnamedeaster.livejournal.com]

They may feel that fanfiction and the like "damage" their IPs but I think it's a nonsensical view. It won't damage it in the eyes of those who read and write fanfic, they love the property, and the mundanes who aren't in fandom in that way, are not at all or only peripherally aware of it.

I've long made it a policy to never talk fandom with the uninitiated, likewise, I avoid reading any conversations participated in by the same. They don't get it and have a skewed view of what fandom is and what the people in it are like. No good can come of subjecting yourself to that.

I'm sorry that you had to read what the usual mudanes feeling is about fandom. It's unfortunate that for many of them, we are either horrible perverts or a complete joke. They just don't get it.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

Beautifully said, as always, Kat. But those in fandom can be just as narrowminded if you aren't in their 'category'. I remember Nigel Snape very patronisingly telling me that he 'didn't read fanfiction' at MISTI-Con, and turning around and walking away from me like I was shit on his shoe. It angered me, but more than that, it angered me that I allowed him to anger me.

I don't care all that much for him, but I do have friends who adore him, and I do care about them. I would rather treasure their friendships than to spend my time worrying about his disapproval. It eventually did cost me Sempraseverus' friendship, but I still defended my right to be pissed off at him.

[akatnamedeaster.livejournal.com]

Oh man, I hope that sort of business doesn't happen to me when I go, since I tend to snap first and then regret it later! ;)

I consider those sorts people in the same category as mundanes to tell you the truth and so their opinion about how I enjoy and participate in fandom, is worth exactly nothing, except maybe a "fuck off" if they get nasty about it.

There are parts of fandom I don't participate in or particularly understand (cosplay and wizard wrock(?), but I wouldn't shit on those people and think they're lesser fans than I am. We all get something different out of this and if fic/wrock/cosplay/pretending to be Dobby's favorite sock, ain't your cup of tea, fine. You can even get snarky and titter about it with your friends in private. But to treat another fan poorly because you don't care for their fandom niche? Poor form because rest assured someone else is looking at how you enjoy fandom and thinking "geez, that's really stupid." No point in getting all haughty about it.

We're all just a bunch of fucking nerds geeking out on a children's book series no matter how we're doing it. Sitting up on a high horse because you feel your way of being a big fucking nerd is so much better than someone else's way of being a big fucking nerd, is to put it mildly, absurd.


Good rule of thumb for fandom as in most things, "don't be a dick."

I have a case of potty mouth today, obviously

[akatnamedeaster.livejournal.com]

Oh and the short version of that: I understand that sentiment and to be treated like that is hurtful, especially when people you care about value that other person's opinion.

However, that opinion, is mean spirited and not worthy of too much consideration, even if our first reaction is hurt. But I know you know that given what you've said. :)

I'm just sorry it caused you to lose contact with someone you cared for, but really, it shouldn't have. We can't all like each other's friends, it impossible in both fandom and RL.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

This is true, Kat, and I think that, in the end, Sempraseverus' problem had a lot less to do with me than with her own behaviour, hence her leaving LiveJournal and all her friends behind here.

The bottom line is that there are too many good reasons (like yourself, for instance) for me not to care about the opinion of someone who doesn't even know me. I've got the lion's share of joy here; I sure don't need someone like him to tell me whether I deserve it or not.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

We're all just a bunch of fucking nerds geeking out on a children's book
series no matter how we're doing it. Sitting up on a high horse because
you feel your way of being a big fucking nerd is so much better than
someone else's way of being a big fucking nerd, is to put it mildly,
absurd.

Good rule of thumb for fandom as in most things, "don't be a dick."

It is my fervent hope and prayer that you and I both go to MISTI, if only so I can put my arms around you and kiss you for this statement. You just keep that potty mouth nice and nasty, Kat. We need people like you in this fandom, to remind folks just what we're doing it for.

[akatnamedeaster.livejournal.com]

You just keep that potty mouth nice and nasty, Kat.

No worries about that! After working from home for so long I've turned into a savage. ;)

I'm still planning on going, thankfully, I've got a while to save the dosh.

[dickgloucester.livejournal.com]

Yup, Wheaton's Law is a good one.

[akatnamedeaster.livejournal.com]

It really is. Too bad more people don't follow it.

[dickgloucester.livejournal.com]

Is that the guy who's on FB as Vladimir Snape?

What a dick. In what way is his cosplay - his inhabiting of the character and enjoyment of all the adulation he garners - different from fanfic?

If I were a dick, I might mention how I had to stop watching a youtube video of him-as-Snape reading one of Beedle's tales because it was so fucking awful, but I'm not, so I won't.

But if I ever catch him dissing my friends again, this badger will get Very English on his ass.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, never mess with a Hufflepuff! ;)

I know there are a lot of folks here who think the world of him, and I had been looking forward to meeting him. Yes, he does think pretty highly of himself, and I don't think even his most loyal of supporters could argue about that ;)

Eh, I roomed with the best Snape there, IMHO. Give me Droxy!Snape any day.

TheHubs™ is planning on cosplaying Steampunk!Snape, and when I mentioned Vladimir Snape, he replied a la Robin Hood: Men In Tights, "because, unlike others, I can do it with a British accent." Another great Hufflepuff, in my opinion.

[akatnamedeaster.livejournal.com]

Ah, so, maybe he was just trying to stay "in-character" and do his best impression of Snape being a dick. :P

I will never get the adulation of cosplayers. Yes, some of them do a great job with their costumes and mannerisms and they can be a lot of fun (if they're not annoying/creepy about it and read the hints to please go away if they are) but in the end, it's someone playing pretend, same as writers and artists do on paper.

[dickgloucester.livejournal.com]

*nods*

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

I love dressing up, and in contrast to some of the folks at Misti, for instance, I was a rank amateur. The vast majority of the cosplayers are just phenomenal, in character and out. They were among the most approachable (It was so adorable watching Joshua Madruga as Lord Voldemort dancing with his four-year-old daughter) and friendly. They are just giddy to be there and getting to have fun doing what they love. Perseus and Draco, who cosplay Lucius and Draco Malfoy, for instance, are two of the loveliest people I've ever met. They are great ambassadors for the fandom, and just encourage everyone around them to enjoy themselves.

Without exception, Joshua, Perseus, Draco, and so many others just love that other people are there supporting them and what they do, and they in turn just couldn't be more encouraging to the rest of us. I found more acceptance and true regard at Misti than I felt dismissal. 99.9% of everyone there just wants everyone else to feel accepted and appreciated.

The incident between me and Nigel Snape was clearly an exception to the rule, and I didn't let it get me down for long. He's got his thing and his fans, and I've got my friends. I really felt special there.

[akatnamedeaster.livejournal.com]

Oh, I agree that they can be wonderful people and a lot of fun to watch and interact with and some of them are just spot on. I would never denigrate their efforts since it must be difficult to be really good at it. I just don't understand the people who treat them as if they actually are the character they're portraying.

But then I never understood the BNF thing either. Even back when fandom was crawling with them and even when some of them were friends. We're all just here having a good time or trying to, no need for pedestals. :)

[droxy.livejournal.com]

I dont get the adulation of cosplayers either. From my experieice it's more character love than costume or coss player. Read this as Adulation = Snape. If I dress as anyone else, it's cool costume, but most folks don't go gaga over Mr. Ollivander. Adulation makes me uncomfortable, and it is all fleeting.

As for Nigel, he does movie snape and only movie snape. He has blue eyes, and he buys his costume. What makes Nigel so popular is 1- he's a guy, 2- he can sing and perform as Snape and do music, and hance act. I cannot do music and I suck at acting. So I let Nigel be Nigel. I do my multiple characters. Getting caught up in cosplayer drama is a waste of time and energy.

I am ageing out of Snape. I've pretty much done what I wanted to do. He was fun. I now just do him for SS/HG fandom. My big issue is locating a new supplier of noses.

You looked great at Misti. =)

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

So did you. It wouldn't be Con without Droxy!Snape. You were one of the highlights for me.

[alabastard.livejournal.com]

Droxy, you never fail to delight, whatever costume, whatever character, your light shines right through. Whatever we do in this fandom, if it can bring us together then it's worth it.

[mimimanderly.livejournal.com]

You know... I realized that you can substitute the word "religion" for "fandom" here. People always seem to think that their "thing" is better than anyone else's "thing". If they are members of the same "thing", then their form of celebrating said "thing" is superior to your way. What, are we going to have clashes between Orthodox Potterites and Reform Potterites? Good gravy, I hope it all doesn't lead to something like a fandom crusade or, even worse, AN INQUISITION!

I would treat this precisely the same way as I would anyone who was trying to convert me to their "thing" or trying to make me feel inferior because I do not even have a "thing". In the end, it is all just a matter of opinion. People's opinions differ, and not only is it all right, it's a good thing. Differences are what keep "things" from getting stagnant. Just remember that when people act superior to you, it's because they have a deep-seated inferiority complex and this is how they make themselves feel better. They are more to be pitied, really. Just tell yourself "it is only their opinion -- nothing more", shrug, and go do your own "thing".

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

Leave it to you, Mimi darling, to really put things into perspective. Being the big, messy ball of insecurity that I am, I do find myself hurt for having to defend my 'thing', because I suppose, deep down I wonder if I'm doing the right 'thing.'

In the end, what I do here makes me happy, and wonder of all wonders, it has made a few other people happy. That's the real payment; that's what folks to don't 'get it' fail to understand. I have felt accepted and understood here; why bother trying to play in the sandbox in which I am neither? I'll never change the opinions of those who see what I do as 'wrong' or ridiculous. All I can do is just have fun with the people who do get me.

[mimimanderly.livejournal.com]

But you don't have to defend your "thing"! Since everything is all just a matter of opinion, your opinion is as valid for you as anyone else's is for them. There is nothing to defend because everyone is right. FOR THEM. There IS no "right thing" or "wrong thing". There is only something that is your "thing" or not your "thing". It is not important what other people think, so it is not important to change their minds. The only factor that should determine what constitutes your "thing" is that is bring you joy. Full stop.

[droxy.livejournal.com]

What mimi says.

[juniperus.livejournal.com]

I still recall Gabaldon's fandom comments and roll my eyes at her pearl-clutching. It's possible to say 'no, thank you' without open insults, drama, or otherwise denigrating others. That is, unless you're ungrateful and quite possibly narcissistic.

Fandom is to canon (whatever the canon) what this dude is to the team he loves:


Points for enthusiasm. Don't piss on someone else's team.

Wheaton's law rules.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

Amen. Do you know what this tells me? That something about the team he supports has inspired loyalty, and boundless enthusiasm (not to mention a certain style). How beautiful is that, that something you do inspires that much love and loyalty? And how drab life would be if there weren't these uninhibited enthusiasts around to remind us how it felt to be totally committed to loving something or someone and not caring who knows it or how outrageously we show it?

[shiv5468.livejournal.com]

Shrugs.

I wouldn't want anyone playing with my Smudger. Other people are entitled to feel differently about their own characters and restrict fan works.

[shiv5468.livejournal.com]

I think it can cheapen the brand.

If I write a character who is bright, hardworking and competent, and someone writes fanfic of them being raped, miserable and woobified only to fall in love with their rapist... oh yes, the brand is cheapened because people are doing to that character exactly what I did't want them to do.

[stgulik.livejournal.com]

You're right that the characters are her property and she has a certain say in how they should be treated. But JR Ward isn't making a distinction between rapefic, crackfic, PWP, and canon fic. She is saying all fanfic cheapens the brand - yours, mine, and ours. And I can't think that's true.

[ex-logospil.livejournal.com]

The day I write something that people love so much it generates fanfic, I'm opening a bottle of champagne ;-)

*tender robed embrace*

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

Me too, my dear one ♥

[gelsey.livejournal.com]

I've always figured I'd support a fandom, even if I don't always like all that fandom does. If an author doesn't want it, I tend to respect it.

That being said, I don't think it's a smart POV to have - I find that fandom promotes a lot of things, manages to really get people going about the books and those people then promote it to more people. I can only see it being good for sales, honestly, and isn't that the bottom line for so many people?

But on the other hand, I feel protective too... in the RP world, there's been a time or two I've wanted to tell someone to stop playing with my character, because I feel like they're abusing my 'child.' Plus, I can kinda see some people not wanting their character all smutted up like fandom can (and will) do. But still, they can't go read all that anyway, since it could get them in big trouble, so it's not like they'd actually know anyway!

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

Very true.

[kenzie-fae.livejournal.com]

I'm at a loss as to how this "harms the brand" when it is essentially free advertising =/

Re:

[stgulik.livejournal.com]

That was my first thought. It could only make the characters and the books more well-known - which boosts sales. I've never heard of JR Ward except on this blog. I assume she's doing alright, but why would she go out of her way to alienate some of her fans?

[bonsaibetz.livejournal.com]

Yeah, there are some authors who are savagely territorial over their work, and litigeous about it to boot. Anne Rice and George R.R. Martinhave been known to even sue people and get non-authorized fan sites who include fanfic taken down.

It's sad.

What many authors forget is that fanfic is a way of exploring one's own wrting style and find one's own voice, and without feedback from the comminuty at large and a good beta, it's hard to improve your craft.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

I couldn't agree more. It truly helped me find my voice. I write my own characters now, and love and protect them very much, and if I am lucky enough that someone likes them enough to want to write fanfiction about them, chances are some of it will be not great. And some of it will be flat out wonderful, if these characters inspire someone to do great things.

HP characters had the ability to inspire us. I have read fanfics that literally had me reeling, they were so good. They made me want to sit down and write something equally awesome, or at least give it a darn good go.

Some of the best pieces of fiction I have ever read were fanfiction, and some of the worst. But it got people writing, being creative, believing in themselves - and it's all done out of love for the characters. That's what fanfiction is all about - showing how much you love these characters.

What greater legacy can there be? I will never be so precious about my characters that they can't suffer a little bad writing for the sake of a possible gem out there. Never. If my characters are strong enough to inspire fanfiction, they're strong enough to survive a bad story about them.

[alabastard.livejournal.com]

Cosplay, fanfiction, fanart, these are, in my not so humble opinion, tributes of the highest nature to something we all love. I have so many unfinished stories myself, and who knows if I'll ever finish or publish them, I am more of an actor and costumer, but I love it all, anything done to celebrate something that has brought us together. Do what you love, and those who denigrate, well, look a bit deeper into the insecurity from whence it comes, have a laugh, and continue doing what you are pulled to do.

[lemonade8.livejournal.com]

True! It's a celebration, pure and simple.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

but I love it all, anything done to celebrate something that has brought us together. Do what you love, and those who denigrate, well, look a bit deeper into the insecurity from whence it comes, have a laugh, and continue doing what you are pulled to do.

You, my dear friend, are such a treasure. Every day I'm more and more glad to call you friend. It's the bringing together that makes this fandom wonderful just as much as the stories that formed the fandom in the first place.

[alabastard.livejournal.com]

That's what it's all about, and anyone who can't accept that is losing out on so much. Why limit yourself with nevers...

[lemonade8.livejournal.com]

Okay, I just read her post and I actually think she was protecting her rights, not trying to put down rp and fic people. She wasn't insulting or denigrating in that initial post, so I would take it with a grain.

Speaking as someone who had to protect an author's rights as dictated by the publisher, lawyer, and past events, this sounds like she's trying to put out fires. (And yes, we were told how to handle any and all rp, fanart and fic that entered the forum.)

The author, if he or she is smart, can NEVER EVER endorse fanfiction. As the laws stand now, someone who is given a green light on writing fan fiction is theoretically able to steal an entire series away from the original author. (Jo Rowling is richer than god, so she's probably really safe from that because she can hire the NASTIEST lawyers ever spawned by satan. ;D ) Also, a writer can NEVER read any fan fiction because if they do and there is an element that they had been planning to use in a future book, they can be sued by said fic writer and their entire livelihood can and will be taken away. The laws do not protect the authors very well, so they have to be extremely firm to publicly deny any derivative works, regardless of how they personally feel. You would not believe the people who tried to shove their fic in front of my author's face and ask her to adore it and approve. We had to filter it for her and delete links etc... because people were just SURE she would want them to co-write the next in the series with her.

The only way to truly protect themselves is to c&d any fanfiction that has been put in front of them. What many of them would really like to do is to leave the fans alone and let them do what they want, but if you wave that fic right under their noses they have to say "please do not do this" publicly and officially.

Other authors are under the delusion that the product that they produced to sell to the public is a precious gem/ living child and must never exist in any way or any form that isn't made and endorsed by the author. (see pearl-clutching douche author mentioned above.)

The truth is that once the book is on the shelf, when someone picks it up and pays money for it, the characters and plot are no longer the sole property of the author. Individual interpretations of everything in that story will be subject to the judgement of each person reading it. Authors cannot dictate the imagination of other people, and if they want their story to never be viewed in any way that isn't their perfect vision of it, then publishing it for public consumption is not something into which they should venture.

But that's my dollar fifty on the whole thing.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

As I say, it was more some of the comments that dismayed me. It wasn't so much her post as some of the reactions to it.

Thank you for showing the author's side of it as well.

[lemonade8.livejournal.com]

There are a lot of people that don't like the idea of fic, and there are a lot of people who want to suck up to the author, there are people who are more Gollum than the authors themselves and don't want anyone tampering with their babies. Some obsessive ones are truly frightening, some people actually believe that the characters are real. I wouldn't take the rabid internet comments of a bestselling urban fantasy author's fans very seriously. A great many of them are very disturbed people. (I speak as an urban fantasy fan, I'm just telling it like it is. These are my people.)

[bloodcult.livejournal.com]

I can only dream of fanfiction of my novel...as long they don't convert my characters to their religion I'm good.

[teddyradiator.livejournal.com]

I feel the same way. Yes, let's leave religion out of it for me as well. Thank you, Bloodcult. You gave me a real chuckle over this.

[lemonade8.livejournal.com]

But once you put those characters out there, they are up for being fantasized about any way that the reader wishes. (I get the feeling that is horrible grammar in the prior sentence. You still get what I mean, right?) Whether they put it out there in a secret corner for other people to read or not, their brains will go where they will. They might imagine your character worshiping acorn squash and you just won't have any control over it.

[bloodcult.livejournal.com]

My point wasn't that I would try to stop them if all my characters found Jesus, merely that that's pretty much the only way I would start to side eye them, sure there are other decisions they could make that would be OOC and/or bad writing but you'd have to go pretty far, in other words to start to offend me.

[lemonade8.livejournal.com]

That's good. I should have seen that's what you were trying to say by the fact that you stated that you would wish for it. And honestly, I believe that you should be allowed to feel the way you do about it, regardless of what the public does or thinks. Don't think I'm trying to dictate emotions. I've just seen some harsh blogs where professional writers have publicly denigrated, insinuated and insulted some of their most devoted fans because they didn't like what was written by some of them.

[kittylefish.livejournal.com]

i can't read all the comments right now, so i'll just share this. my sister got a book the other day called death comes to pemberly that is basically pride & prejudice fanfic by the respected mystery author p.d. james. that's pretty much what i would have contributed to that thread. and then i would have left it alone, because most ignorant people don't really want to have it pointed out to them and are uninterested in change.

and the only other thing i would say is that if an author mucks around writing fanfic and honing their style and then decides that they don't want other people writing fanfic of their work, i think that's hypocritical and i'd lose a lot of respect for them. yeah, i know that because it happened, lol.